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No producer today, so this one is in three parts. Coming to grips with and responding to accusations and concerns, and grappling with my relationship to prophets.
Transcript
[00:00:00] OK, darn it, it cut off early, so I’m gonna have to really sorry I had to just stop and start the video, but I was talking about my relationship with the state my state president and um one thing we we spoke on the phone for hours yesterday and um and one thing I really tried to clarify with him, he, he had such good um counsel anyway, we’re we’re really trying to work this through and trying to be understood right because these are tricky things, but I think that there is some concern that I am. Like setting out to try to undermine people’s faith in the church or in the prophets, and I had to really listen to that because that is so not my intention at all. What I see is that I do believe, and I’ve expressed it before, so I won’t go into it too long, but when, when the, the teaching that the prophet can never lead the people astray is part of the part of your foundation. I think you’re spiritually vulnerable, right? I think that’s a spiritually dangerous and spiritually stunting place to be. I think that. Because then when people see things that leaders have said that they know are not right or when they see leaders do things or say things that they that they believe to their core to not be correct, it leaves them in this horrible place where they either have to shut off their personal inspiration, which sometimes isn’t even possible because you just know what you know or you’ve had experiences, you know. And but we’re told to like subvert that to the, I, I, I mean, I mean you can be, I’m trying to be so careful in all of this because I don’t want to misrepresent anything, but I think people can feel like that can create a lot of conflict, a lot of cognitive dissonance where people can be left in a place of feeling like it has to be either here or either there just like we were talking about the Savior on the cross, right? What it’s either true or it’s not, and I guess what I have learned is how important it is to understand that maybe it’s not that it’s either true or it’s not, but our idea has been somewhat misunderstood. I’m not trying to weaken people’s faith in our leaders. I’m not trying to ever say don’t listen to the leaders. Never, or you’re free to just disagree with them and do what you want, and they don’t matter. That’s that’s not been my desire at all. So it’s good for me to know that that’s how some people are interpreting what I’m saying so I can try to be. Much more careful and I have done some real work um with the Lord trying to understand where I am and where might be a better place for me to be. So I, I’ll go on with that as we go forward. But um anyway, it was, I, I was. I like, like, I guess this is how I think about it. I absolutely um completely sustain my state president and my bishop. I think they are good people doing their very best at a difficult job, you know, I expressed this to my state president. I pray for them. I want to make their job easier, not harder, you know, I want to do what I can to serve, to serve them in their calling, to lighten the load and, you know, and I.
[00:02:59] And I and I take their counsel extremely seriously. I absolutely prayerfully seek to know, you know, how I can apply it or what God wants me to do with it. I recognize that they have very different stewardships than I have. I would never go in and say this is what you need to do for the church, or this is what you need to do for the state like I. I would never think that you know that’s my revelation to receive or my place to direct and at the same time I don’t believe that they have better access to God, that they have a better vehicle or a better channel. I do think absolutely in terms of getting answers for the state just like I wouldn’t expect one of them to. Be given inspiration about how I raise my children necessarily, right, or how I give birth, going back to an old story, you know, but um we have different stewardships, and I honor that. But I do think that I have access to God and I also don’t think that that means that they can’t do something that, you know, was. Uh, I don’t, I don’t, anyway, I’m losing my words. I, I don’t think that that means that they are infallible, right? And I don’t know at what level of leadership that changes. I have, so for me personally, the way I look at my bishop and my state president is the same way I look at my general leaders like really good men doing an impossible. Job hopefully relying on the Lord as much as possible and getting inspiration and revelation for the entire church and what direction should you know and and like with the huge responsibility to speak in general conference every 6 months, sometimes in President Nelson’s case to speak multiple times plus everything else that they do. So, so I, and I know that that makes some people uncomfortable because you know my state president really feels like no they’re on a different level and And I can honor that and I’m really considering it and you know that there’s some kind of that they’re somehow different than the rest of us or um you know, less um less susceptible to, you know, and so I’m, I’m trying to consider that, but anyway, I just wanted to express that I do, if I haven’t said it before, I, I. I did do some deep work. I guess I’m going all around and backwards on this, um, because I was going to come up with the end, but I did have to really seriously think about it after talking to him and think, what do I believe about profits, right? What like and temples, I had some conversations with other people where I just expressed that I don’t know a lot of these things. This isn’t, you know, I don’t, I’m not settled on how I think about it yet and, and I really, um. You know, as I last night just sat and pondered and thought and prayed and I recognized I’ve known this, but I guess I just really got in and looked at it, how much pain I have, how much hurt and how much trauma. Around things to do with the leaders of the church, right? Like just things that have affected me in very personal and difficult and painful ways that have added up and that have felt to me like they were kind of like, like our current leadership has been harder for me than any other.
[00:06:17] I’ve never had these struggles to this degree before in any way. Like, you know, I always, I’ve always loved listening to conference and even though. You know, as soon as you have sort of a, um, you know, you go to a new place in your faith, it can start to be a little bit harder, like, oh, that didn’t sound good, that didn’t sit right, that doesn’t resonate or that sounds, uh, you know, and Especially when you can hear people like, you can hear people listening to that talk and you know they’re thinking about you. You know, they’re, they’re using those talks like I to judge you. Like I said, even last conference, there was, I, I got some, I got at least, well, I got some Facebook messages or emails before the talk had even finished letting me know. See, see, you know, and I, I, oh I hate that and there have been um talks that have been Deeply um painful and yeah on various topics, you know, and then we came to 2020 and I don’t want to go into all of it, but for me it wasn’t good and um someone asked in a comment recently if I listened to general conference. I think they’re trying, you know, I think people are trying to go, where are you? Are you safe or are you not? And, and I, you know, I, I’m, I’m figuring out where I am, but I answered her very honestly and. In spring of 2020 and April conference, I prayed, Lord, should I listen to this conference because I was very pregnant and I was struggling so much and I know I don’t want to at this point at least get into all of the stuff with the shutdown and everything that happened in 2020 and how that was all handled. I, you know, everyone has their perspective. My perspective is mine and it’s very strong, you know, it was very hard for me. And I, I understand that people see it differently. My state president sees it very differently than I see it, you know, and so, but for me, I’m living in my own brain in my own world, so it’s my own experience, you know, and I didn’t know if I would be able to handle watching general conference under those circumstances with where I already was without it just creating more negative feelings, right? I. Like every time I listen to conference, it is the outpouring of the spirit that makes it worthwhile, it’s that talk that just. You know, that I’m just like, I am so thankful that I’m in this church and that, you know, I want that experience, but I don’t want more to add to the negative pile and so,
[00:08:45] anyway, I prayed about it in Um, April of 2020 and I just had an answer just I was given peace and I said it will be just fine. You know, that’s basically, I can’t even remember what the words were, but it was basically it will be fine. So I kind of thought, oh, I’ll go ahead and listen. No, it turned out I went into labor just as conference started with my, um, little number 12 baby. And, um, you know, so for me that felt like the Lord’s so involved in such a tender mercy. I was in labor the whole time during general conference and, you know, and then I have gone back and listened to some talks here and there and, you know, tried to catch up, but I am still trying to figure it out. And then I, um, you know, going forward, um, that next conference. I hadn’t expected it because you never know when it’s gonna happen. As soon as I sat down to start watching conference, it brought back the last conference, which is when I gave birth to my baby that we had lost, and I Um, It was, it wasn’t, you know, it’s, it’s hard when that grief just gets ripped open again and so conferences came to kind of symbolize not only all of the struggles with the difference of beliefs and the things that I found that seemed so troubling to me, but also with my deep grief and I. You know, so I just have tried anyway, so that conference, I didn’t watch at all cause I was a mess and um. You know, and then going forward to the next spring conference, I’ve just tried to be prayerful and I listened to that conference, but I guess that would be um or the next, I, I, I’m, yeah, the spring of 2021, I can’t even remember, but There, you know, each time like I kind of feel like I’m just um. I don’t have any defenses, you know, I’m very, I felt very vulnerable and also like rubbed raw where the tiniest little thing being touched on was too hard, you know, and so all of that has added up and so, and it’s been painful. It’s been really hard. I have, you know, we’ve walked through the things in 2017 which these leaders were, you know, kind of like. The most supportive of that was really hard in my family and with all of my extended family and my loved ones who left the church and have became so hostile and then just in my own family as well with my daughters and then going forward to all of these other things and then my personal loss,
[00:11:09] it just added bit by bit piece by piece where I already was, you know, I, I, I’m, I like getting into the scriptures. I like depth. I like insight, and it sometimes would feel hard to. Listen to conference wanting to be fed and feeling left unfed, you know, and that’s why I’ve always been so grateful that there’s been at least one talk, if not more, where just the spirit poured out and I’m like, OK, thank you, you know, and that started to be a little harder to experience in all of this trauma added bit by bit and piece by piece to where I have, you know, each time I’ve tried to go listen to conference, but I think I’m listening. With kind of a guarded, I’m, I’m really trying to not just go to it critically. I go to, that’s why I pray whether I should listen because I don’t want to be add more to my pile of, I don’t like that, you know, so I tried to go, Lord. Should I listen? And um, you know, so I have had to acknowledge that and go, I really do. I can see why people are upset because I have struggled so deeply and You know, and I, and I, I guess I’m recording this all feels not coincidental that conference is next week. I’m having this experience this week, you know, so that has been my relationship, especially with our current leadership that it’s not been at all that I have tried to say, hey, don’t worry about profits like, like, not at all. This has just been my personal struggle, my personal journey, and it’s been a hard one, you know, and, um, again, when I. I can’t remember. I there was something said in the conference after I lost my little 13th girl that was again just hit on things. It’s been hard and so, um. So I, you know, listen to him talking about like he kept saying, it’s a yes, there are things that our prophets have said that are wrong, but it’s at least 1000 to 1 of what’s so good and I was listening and thinking, I I can’t Think of really genuinely in my heart the good from our current profit. That’s a horrible thing to admit. But that’s where I’ve been. It’s just been the hard has been so overwhelming. And, and I’m scared to even open the door cause I don’t want to get more hard, you know. And so I, I was going to talk about this at the end. I’m going so out of order, so forgive me, this is just on the flight, but I did spend last night just saying, Lord, am I, have I shut myself off to
[00:13:42] something that’s true or something that’s good, or am I looking with just too much of a critical eye and only looking at or seeing at what looks to me to be very bad and You know, like, is it true that leaders of this church can do things that are wrong and also can do things that are really, really good, you know, I’m, I’m just like all of us, right? And if I’ve been to, like, like I want us to stay in the church and I guess I kind of had felt like, oh, I’m being so honest right now, but I guess I had kind of felt like stay despite. Our current leaders, yeah, that’s a hard thing to confess, but I guess that’s kind of where I’ve been and now, and, and I’m still working through it. I’m still not settled because all of this is still there. I still have all of this trauma, you know, but I did. Last night I just thought, OK, and I prayerfully again turned on, um, you know, went to LDS.org and just started listening to specifically President Nelson’s conference talks from the last couple of years of conferences and um. It was good, there were, you know, I’m still. And still torn and struggling because there are still things that really, uh, you know, but the good did definitely massively outweigh the bad. I wrote down just a couple of things. Again, this is what I was going to do at the end, but I wrote down some of the quotes that were really um beautiful to me, and, and I’m glad that this is happening now. Like I said, maybe it’s inspired that I’m supposed to release this. I hope it’s not just boring and you know, we’re going into conference and I think I’ll have a different Perspective where maybe the Lord is helping me heal some of my trauma. I’ve had, I’ve had the Lord heal my trauma and PTSD in different ways. I hate using those overused terms, but really like COVID gave me PTSD with what I experienced. It’s been so hard and, and it’s gone into so many different branches and And then maybe people won’t understand that, but if you, I don’t know if I’ve shared on this channel before, maybe I will at another time. I don’t want to go into it right now because I’m feeling a little more healed, so I don’t want to go back into it, but what I experienced losing children and dealing with hospitals and all of that during that time has not been good, not been good. And then the church was all tangled up in that completely, and, you know, it’s just not good. And so, so it’s added to everything else. So. Anyway, I’m just gonna read a couple of quotes from recent conference talks that President Nelson gave that I found truth in and that I, you know, I, I can’t say that I’m healed or that I’m like Yeah,
[00:16:32] follow the prophet, you know, like, like I, I still don’t believe that that is like I think we follow the savior and the prophets are people on earth that are here to help us follow the savior, right? And hopefully they are the leaders of the church. Like I like, I know that that might trick be yeah yeah. Uncomfortable for people, but that’s how that is my perspective. So I’m saying, OK, so are they prophets who help us follow, you know, can I call him the prophets instead of I’ve tended to kind of refer to him as the president of the church. This is really vulnerable. This has been my struggle, but I also, I guess I am hoping that people can understand. I don’t know, but the way that my state president has interacted with me has, um, he didn’t ask me to repent or to consider. He just listened to me and expressed his perspective and, you know, we, we really had a good back and forth conversation and a lot of what he said, I, I’ve been thinking about, you know, and so, um, So, and maybe there are still people that just wish he would just kick me out for their benefit, but um I appreciate him. Helping me try to be better. You know, I think I I would hope that everyone appreciates that, and that’s what we all want for everyone in this church instead of just to control, control other people and control the narrative. So anyway, just a couple of little things, um, this was from October 2022. Overcome the world and find rest. What does it mean to over this is quoting President Nelson. What does it mean to overcome the world? It means overcoming the temptation to care more about the things of the world than the things of God. It means trusting the doctrine of Christ more than the philosophies of men. It means delighting in truth, denouncing deception and becoming humble, humble followers of Christ. That is beautiful. That is exactly what I believe and it said so well and you know, I could have that hanging on my wall, that is, I, I loved every part of that. Um, there’s a lot of this talk that I just loved. But overcoming the world does not mean that your resistance to sin will increase. Your heart will soften as your faith in Jesus Christ increases. Overcoming the world means growing to love God and His beloved Son more than you love any anyone or anything else. This is really hitting me because I am experiencing. Trying to have my heart softened and feeling like the Lord is putting this all in place to let my heart both heal and soften. I don’t know that I’ve had a hard heart. I’ve had a broken. And you know I’ve had. It’s been hard and um anyway, so it’s been good to hear these messages each time you seek for and follow the promptings of the spirit, each time you do anything good, things that the natural man would not do, you are overcoming the world. It happens over a lifetime as we repeatedly embrace the doctrine of Christ. As we strive to live the higher laws of Jesus Christ, our hearts and our very natures begin to change. The Savior lifts us above the pole of this fallen world by blessing us with greater charity, humility,
[00:19:45] generosity, kindness, self-discipline, peace, and rest, and all of this, I guess I, I missed all of this because I’ve been too broken, and it’s beautiful. It’s pure truth. All of this is pure truth. But yoking yourself with the savior who’s talking about the struggles of the world means having access to his strength and redeeming power. Ezra to Benson. He quotes Esta Benson saying, men and women who turn their lives over to God will discover that He can make a lot more out of their lives than they can. He will deepen their joys, expand their vision, quicken their minds, lift their spirits, multiply their blessings, increase their opportunities, comfort their souls, raise up friends, and pour out peace. That is all. Anyway, I guess, I guess I just loved all of this. Like I, I don’t want it. I’m like, I, I, I don’t know exactly what I’m trying to say. I testify of the truthfulness of this. These are the teachings of prophets. They’re things that I have taught my children that I believe to my core, that I, you, you know, I guess I, um, maybe I had a different expectation because I feel like in so many ways I learned these things from the Lord. And so I, you know, so it’s And like, like, I guess I’m saying amen to what they said, and maybe I expect prophets to tell me things I haven’t learned from the Lord or to tell me things I don’t know, and maybe sometimes that happens. I, you know, but anyway, these things hit me so hard, it did give me that outpouring of the spirit that I was so thankful for. It’s been a very good opportunity for me to repent, you know, I’m always talking about we can repent, which just means changing our heart, changing our direction. Doing it differently and this has been a good opportunity for me to repent of my hardheartedness against our leaders that has come through and things that I’ve said, you know, I’m like I said, I’m still a little, um, I, I can’t feel like I’m perfectly happy because it’s still hard. I have some trepidation about next conference, but I’m so thankful that I got to read that message. I loved, um, I read, you know, I went, I went to many, many of them. This is April 2022, the power of spiritual momentum, which I actually really loved as well. I loved, it just hit me so hard when he said.
[00:22:10] Any war is a horrifying violation of everything the Lord Jesus Christ stands for and teaches. What a profound statement of truth that I didn’t know he had said. And um and then he, how he applied this had so much personal application for me over what I’ve been struggling with over the last few years. My call today, dear brothers and sisters, is to end conflicts that are raging in your heart, your home, and your life, bury any and all inclination to hurt others, whether those be a temper, a sharp tongue, or a resentment for someone who has hurt you. That’s the. I’ve tried so hard to not have resentment, but I have had ongoing pain and, and fear of stepping back into things that might be painful. It’s gonna stop again any second, so I’m sorry, that’ll be a part three. I’m learning I’m not very good at being concise. He goes on, the savior commanded us to turn the other cheek, to love our enemies, to pray for those who despitefully use us, and those are things I’ve been trying to do, and I now have this additional tool to help me, you know, to see it just, it resonated with me. This part, especially, how can we expect peace to exist in the world when we are not individually seeking peace and harmony, brothers and sisters, I know what I’m suggesting is not easy, but followers of Jesus Christ should set the example for all the world to follow. I plead with you to do all you can to end personal conflicts that are currently raging in your hearts and in your lives that actually spoke to me so directly with my personal conflict with our leaders, you know, as well as the conflicts I’ve already been so aware of and working on. I have some difficult situations that have been hard, but. This anyway, I just found this to be so beautiful and so true and so inspired and I loved it. I. I have, I’ve expressed to my state president a couple of times that I don’t know how to love our leaders, you know, when he said, like, we love our leaders, you know, and I’ve just in moments of complete honesty, I’ve just, I don’t know how to love them. I don’t love them. I don’t, you know, and. I feel so betrayed by them, I feel so hurt by them. I feel so damaged by things they’ve done and. That’s been my experience. So this has been the kind of the opening cracking the door open to allow me to love them and um specifically President Nelson, that’s where I’m starting. There are other leaders that have kept, you know, that I can look forward to their talks with much less concern. And so anyway, he He continued, you know, I, I,
[00:25:02] I just have a few more quotes. October October of 21, it is imperative that we have a firm spiritual foundation built upon the rock of our Redeemer, Jesus Christ. Yes, absolutely. So I ask each of you how firm is your foundation and what reinforcements to your testimony and understanding of the gospel are needed, and I guess that’s, I didn’t even think about that until I’m reading it now. I just pulled it out because I loved it. It resonated with me, but now I’m thinking, oh. That’s what I want to be contributing to is helping people have reinforcements to the foundation of their testimony to help get some of the stand out. I’m trying to help, and it’s so good for me to think anyway, to, to feel like maybe they can see that I’m on their team and maybe I can see that I’m, that they’re on my team, and we are, you know, anyway, this is very vulnerable for me to admit.
